Tuesday, September 29, 2009

How Alex Jones has damaged the 9/11 Truth Movement


My critique of why Alex Jones is losing his mind and can’t be taken seriously anymore

by Larry Simons
September 29, 2009

1. His loud, obnoxious, out-of-control, on-air mental breakdowns

A picture is worth a thousand words. Take a look:















How can you take someone seriously when they act like they just escaped from a mental institution?

2. His juvenile, asinine behavior with intelligent, well-behaved guests on his show

How can we forget the interview Alex Jones did with Zeitgeist director Peter Joseph in October 2008 in which Jones continually interrupts Joseph, engages in insane tirades and projects, ignores and twists Joseph’s points and basically acts like a complete and utter DICKHEAD?

During this interview, it was so fucking crystal clear that Alex Jones was completely threatened by Peter Joseph’s incredible intelligence. Jones has always touted himself as being the father of the 9/11 truth movement, the pioneer of alternative media and the bringer of all truth, yet it was Jones [during this interview] that felt the need to continually interrupt Joseph, talk over him and resort to childish baby voices and sarcastic mocking.

Jones was completely and visibly threatened by Joseph’s vast knowledge of every subject Jones mentioned. Joseph’s incredible patience to continue talking to Jones and not immediately end the interview along with his calm demeanor and his refusal to raise his voice and insult Jones [even when Jones was doing it to him] speaks volumes to his impeccable character. It was a 2-hour interview. This is a portion:





Here’s a clip of the same interview where Jones accuses Joseph of yelling back at him when it was actually Jones who was yelling at Joseph. It was a colossal lie on Jones’ part. Joseph kept a continual calm voice and demeanor throughout the entire interview. Jones also accused Joseph of insulting him, when again, it was Jones who continually insulted Joseph.

Jones continually lies and distorts Joseph’s words, mocks and insults him repeatedly during this interview and never lets Joseph offer a counter argument. There must have been 60 or 70 times during this interview where I wanted to HEAR what Joseph was saying because it was intelligent, rational and profoundly interesting but Jones would interrupt him repeatedly. I felt like screaming at my computer screen, “ALEX JONES, SHUT THE FUCK UP!

I have no idea why [or how] Joseph sat there during the entire 2 hours. I would have ended it after Jones’ first childish and mocking rant.



3. His love affair with celebrities and fame

At one time, Alex Jones was more interested in delivering real news stories to his listeners who tuned in to listen to alternative news stories. That meant Jones would have on the very best people in a particular industry whether it was topics such as vaccines, the economy, chemtrails, the Iraq war or 9/11.

Jones loves schmoozing with Jesse Ventura, Willie Nelson, Charlie Sheen, and whatever celebrity he can get on his program. It’s not about the real news anymore. It’s about fame, more listeners, more financial support and most importantly, Jones’ ego and self-promotion. It’s now a business to Jones. It’s a love of celebrity. Just in the last two weeks alone, Jones interviewed Charlie Sheen, Shooter Jennings [son of Waylon Jennings] and Megadeth guitarist Dave Mustaine.

4. His association with frauds and nutballs

Several times this year, Jones has interviewed nutball David Icke. Jones now claims he’s “honored” to have Icke on his program, despite the fact that in 1998, Jones said this about Icke:

“He’s either a smart, opportunist con-man, or he’s completely insane or he’s working for them directly. But, I tend to think he’s just a con-man..uh, who understands how things works, and is just a real opportunist.”
Here’s the audio of it:



Now, Alex Jones and David Icke are bosom buddies.

Jones also endorses well-known fraud Kevin Trudeau. This is the guy you see on late night infomercials selling his ““They” Don’t Want You To Know About” books. Trudeau was on Jones’ show this past May discussing a current court case he is involved in where Trudeau has been ordered by a judge to pay $37 million, which is the amount of money that consumers paid Trudeau in response to his deceptive infomercials that the judge ordered Trudeau not to make.

Alex called this a violation of his first amendment rights. Jones is simply lying. To be ordered not to engage in fraud is not stripping away first amendment rights. Trudeau is still allowed to sell books on his infomercials because of first amendment rights, but Trudeau is not allowed to use the books to promote or sell products or services that are fraudulent.

Of course, another tiny fact that Jones did not tell his listeners was that back in 1990, Trudeau posed as a doctor in order to deposit $80,000 in bad checks and later plead guilty to larceny. Trudeau used the credit cards of just 11 of his customers to rob them of a grand total of $122, 735. He spent two years in prison. You think Jones mentions this to his listeners? Of course not.

In early September 2009, Jones did an interview with nutball Pastor Steve Anderson. Jones introduced the pastor as “someone who I really admire”. It wasn’t the first interview Jones did with him, but it was the first after Anderson did a sermon called, “Why I Hate Barack Obama”, in which Steve Anderson said to his congregation that he prays for the slaughter of homosexuals and for Barack Obama to die.

Listen to this clip


This is the same man [Anderson] who also said to a gay radio talk show host in early September that he doesn’t even consider it murder if someone were to kill homosexuals or Obama. Anderson ended the interview [after the radio show host revealed he was gay and asked Anderson, “Do you hope I die tonight?”] by telling the talk show host, “If you’re a homosexual, I hope you get brain cancer like Ted Kennedy”.

This is the kind of person Alex Jones “really admires”………….nutballs.

Listen to the interview between Anderson and the gay talk show host






There’s no recourse for Alex Jones. It’s simply too late for him to turn back now [I believe, I believe, I believe he's losing his mind]. He has not made the cover-ups of 9/11 untrue by his behavior and company he keeps, but he sure as hell has dethroned himself as the #1 source for 9/11 information [if he ever was].

33 comments:

the_last_name_left said...

well said!

Gee - it's hard to watch.

The interview with Joseph was interesting, even though AJ did his best to ruin it.

Joseph's point about the NWO is crucial: he seems to be pointing to one of Jones' critical analytical weaknesses. See, Jones seems to think that getting rid of "the (evil) perps" aka the NWO will suffice as a solution. However - that fails to address why the supposed NWO came into power, and did what it did........

Obviously, there is a system that breeds institutions/organisations/individuals that function as a supposed NWO. And that system is capitalism which defines the relationships people have with resources, production, society, other individuals, law, etc.

Simply removing the supposed NWO leaves in place everything else - which means the same conditions apply. So the same results should be expected.

I characterise this as Alex's belief that capitalism is actually fine......it's just been corrupted....by the NWO. Point being, he actually supports the system of capitalism which generates the problems he denounces and declares are caused by "evil" - by the NWO. Socialists would say it isn't because these people are "evil".......it's because capitalism is "evil", if anything. Under capitalism irrational, and seemingly heartless and cruel acts are rational - because they make money - buy influence - whatever. That's a systemic reward - not one based on whether one is "evil" or not. "Evil" is a description of the effects - it isn't the cause. Capitalism is the cause - at least to socialist, for example.

But Alex's belief in capitalism - and his belief in it having become degenrate and corrupted - is the exact same sort of claim made by the far-right.....who believe it is jewish capitalism that is the problem - not capitalism itself. The far-right, and anti-semites, believe jews have corrupted "pure american" capitalism.....in much the same way Alex Jones believes "The NWO" have corrupted capitalism.

See - under Jones' conception, capitalism escapes criticism. Capitalism IS NOT THE PROBLEM!! according to Jones. It's just the present, corrupted and degnerate version that's a problem. And he says the degeneracy stems from ....."the NWO". Same as the anti-semites........they believe it is because of Jews......not because of capitalism per se.

That's why I wonder if Jones knowlingly uses such a conception - to act as euphemism for "jews". NWO = degenerate capitalism = joooos. It's an uncanny parallel - it's exact.

Whether Alex knowlingly operates a parallel of the anti-semitic far-right belief is debatable. However, it is certainly NOT debatable that a considerable part of his audience certainly DOES think Alex means "jewish world conspiracy" when he speaks about "the NWO".

When you consider how close Alex is to major operatives in the far-right, it is very hard to believe he doesn't know that he's espousing a direct parallel of what the far-right are saying.

Anyway - what AJ believes he's doing is somewhat irrelevant. What he actually does is important - not what he thinks about it.

Anyway - Joseph's thing about conditioning has a parallel in Marx........people's thoughts and actions are determined by their environment. Hence "taking out" a few "bad guys" is not going to work - the environment (social/economic structure) will produce more. Because that's what the system demands, and what it breeds.

The same criticism can be made of anti-semitic conspiracy theory - do they really think everything will be tickety-boo once all the joooos are gone? I mean - what will have changed? Nothing - apart from we'd be a society newly formed on racial lines, responsible for a new holocaust.....great stuff?

the_last_name_left said...

Another point - Jones loves to cling to the constitution......he's a patriot right.

Yet he and so many others love to say how they know all these high-level NWO criminals are going to hang for their crimes........"We know who you are........we know what you've done!"

Alex and his fans talk about hanging them.......git yer guns....and all the rest of it.

I don't know where the constitution allows all that........surely it provides for a fair trial.....redress......fairness and balance......the RIGHTS OF THE ACCUSED......not a lynchmob?

Alex and his fans act as judge, jury and executioner. Oh - how constitutional! Aren't you impressed by their commitment to the Bill of Rights now? No? Me neither.

Likewise for the anti-semitic crowd.........the Bill of Rights and Due Process don't apply to jooos? Merely being jewish is enough to prove "guilt" for some.

These people cling to the constitution only when it suits them.

the_last_name_left said...

hey - on your earlier post saying PP's webmaster Watson had visited your site......the link you gave gives his referring page......a google page...which had searched for "joe fields nazi".

that took him to my comment at your site, presumably.

that PROVES they are not wholly ignorant of the people around Willis Carto/AFP - whom THEY PROMOTE and SHARE BELIEFS with.

Messianic Akratist said...

@name - the problem is NOT capitalism, it is corporatism, that is, government interference in the "free" market.
Read Lenin's comments about the importance of maintaining central banks when the socialists take over.
A managed money means a managed economy.
End the Fed!

the_last_name_left said...

@messianic

What? Are you saying Lenin did not say the problem IS capitalism?

He did. It is.

What do you mean by corporatism?

Anonymous said...

Are you giving up on Alex Jones?

Messianic Akratist said...

I did not say that Lenin did not believe capitalism was the problem. But he acknowledged that central banking - to "manage" the money - would be as necessary in a socialist economy as it was in what passed for a capitalist economy.
Corporatism is the system we have now, where big business and big government are in bed with each other, protecting each other against all other comers except themselves. For an important recent example, look at the revolving door between DC, especially the Dept of Treasury, the Federal Reserve, and Goldman Sachs. The fat cats like the system where they can "privatize" their profits and get the government to bail them out and disburse their losses among all taxpayers. The problem for them is that, eventually such systems tend to evolve toward government control of the corporations. This is properly known as fascism, or national socialism. This system is just as immoral and just as ineffective as other varieties of socialism.

the_last_name_left said...

M: [Lenin] acknowledged that central banking - to "manage" the money - would be as necessary in a socialist economy as it was in what passed for a capitalist economy.

Marx supported a (world) central bank - providing capital at low/zero cost. What's the problem with it?

M: Corporatism is the system we have now, where big business and big government are in bed with each other, protecting each other against all other comers except themselves

Ok - thanks for clarifying what you meant. Other definitions of corporatism are possible....a la stakeholder idea.

M: The fat cats like the system where they can "privatize" their profits and get the government to bail them out and disburse their losses among all taxpayers......This system is just as immoral and just as ineffective as other varieties of socialism.

That is no socialism. It's a privatised oligarchy, or something. A corporatism. Not socialism.

What's "social" about your definition of "corporatism"? NOTHING. So why call it "socialism"? It is NOT socialism - so please don't call it socialism. Call it corporatism.....or whatever.....but it isn't socialism.

M: such systems tend to evolve toward government control of the corporations. This is properly known as fascism

Only if you accept Mussolini's vague defintion. (Written by Gentile, anyway?)

I don't think that qualifies as "fascism"......the post-war British Labour government which created the National Health Service and nationalised the commanding heights of the British economy would qualify under your defintion of fascism. That's absurd?

Fascism is ultra-nationalism and a desire for a "phoenix-like rebirth" of the nation. That's totally missing from your (Mussolini) definition.
-------

Anyway - you say the problem is *not* capitalism. We disagree.

My point is that whilst Alex Jones points to the formless and vague "NWO" as being the culprits, he has nothing to offer beyond suggesting the removal of such people as comprise his "NWO".

That leaves NOTHING changed. The same system would still be effective - and the same results should be expected, again.

Alex's analysis and solution are vacuous - empty.

It amounts to a witch-hunt.....against "evil"....."the NWO". (Just like the far-right would have a witch-hunt against Joooos and leave everything else the same.....replacing "joooish elites" with their own. Whooopeee.)

Here's an example of the contradictions inevitably thrown up by Alex's dismal "analysis":

The Federal Reserve is accused of being central to the problem.

But the Fed is a private, for-profit enterprise.

For anti-govt types like AJ that fact alone should guarantee it be a success.

But AJ wants the government to audit the FED.........oh....so suddenly government is good at something? Auditing privatised banking.......

Why does the private, for-profit Fed Res even NEED auditing? Without government who would do it? Without taxes who would pay for the audit? etc etc etc.

Clearly, Alex's lame analysis and support for capitalism and privatisation and abolition of government, taxes etc.....leads nowhere. Except to the same place he claims is so abominable........where private corporate power rules the roost.....and where the public are trampled on, exploited, and ignored.

the_last_name_left said...

AJ supports free-market fundamentalist Ron Paul. RP is a neo-liberal.....Mises....Hayek.....Friedman.

Yet the effects, and institutions of neo-liberalism are the things he calls "the NWO".

And the solution - government "interference" in the private Fed Reserve......is condemned by AJ as "socialism".......which he sometimes also calls "the NWO".

See........there's no real logic or coherence to AJ's position. Because his analysis is faulty - even empty.

He has a confused conception of political ideology too. No difference between left and right? That's why ALex Jones is right-wing, I suppose? It doesn't make sense. Only rightwingers claim "there's no difference between left and right." They want to pretend there's no alternative to their own views.......but there is. It's called socialism - and it's LEFTWING. There IS a difference.

People who do not recognise the problems of capitalism are not leftwing. Supporters of capitalism are rightwing, in so far as they support inequality.....exploitation for private individual profit.....property rights....individualism.....nationalism....

That's as opposed to socialism, which supports equality, opposes exploitation for private gain, promotes shared/social ownership, collectivism, internationalism, egalitarianism (anti-racism etc).

There are very clear, and profound differences between left and right. The difference is fundamental......and can be traced through ethics and basic ideological divisions......right back to the greeks.

Alex Jones claims "the NWO is socialist"......and then says there is no difference between left and right!

Alex also claims "the NWO" is "satanic"......and god knows what else. He's talking utter tripe. That's obvious? He has no idea what the NWO is.......really. That's why I make the point about how closely AJ's conception parallels that of the far-right anti-semitic crowd......and why such a crowd find AJ so appealing.

Alex has no real definition of his "enemy"....the NWO. But we can see that his definition parallels the far-right's definition of the enemy as "jewish".

If we take Alex's NWO as a euphemism for "jews".......his conception is identical to that of the far-right, isn't it?

Alex would be FAR FAR less acceptable if he used "jews" instead of "the NWO". He wouldn't make so much money, would he? Nor would he be able to mainstream his views.......they'd be rejected outright very quickly. That is NOT what ALex Jones is about - he wants and needs to be POPULAR. Hence the amorphous vagueness of his "NWO" instead of "jews"?

Because the problem for Alex isn't "capitalism".....it isn't "the system" of capitalism.......it's degenrate capitalism....corruption of pure capitalism......that's the problem for Alex. Likewise for the far-right.

The far-right think the degeneracy of capitalism is because of "the jews".......for Alex it's because of "the NWO".

Apart from that term, their conceptions are essentially identical?

Larry said...

Phill, there's no point in arguing with this guy---he has no clue how American entities work---he's a Brit. He has no clue what our Constitution says. He continually argues about things he knows NOTHING about---and all he does is copy and paste his responses from other sources. He has already swallowed his own foot many times in our 9/11 debates.

the_last_name_left said...

I notice Larry totally fails to address the content.

Play the ball, Larry - not the player?

Larry said...

You were debating wih Phill, not me.

Gregory said...

Yet you still link to PrisonPlanet from your site.

Larry said...

Your point? I still agree with Bill Maher on religion too despite the fact that he's a sell-out on 9/11.

Gregory said...

Alex Jones = PrisonPlanet

the_last_name_left said...

There'll be nothing left if Larry removes all the Alex Jones stuff.

:)

Larry thinks Alex Jones is manipulative and dishonest......except when Alex is dealing with 911 Troof.

Somehow Alex has never manipulated his audience over 911......only other stuff.

Somehow Alex is still to be believed over 911.

Hmmm.

Anonymous said...

how easy for this asshole to totaly ignore you again. he spins,lies then when hes beat witch he usauly is, he says it doesnt matter. since this last name left guy is a queeenie hes used to swalllowing.

Anonymous said...

hmmmmmmm. this last name left guy was a truther at one time. what alex didnt print his stories. hmmmm. now the guy goes against alex. how pathetic. larrys about the truth and stands his ground against anyone who goes from the truth. period. once you get hurt you are like a 8 yr old and hold a grudge. dont you, you queeenie?

mr truth said...

dont hate the player last name. hate the game. build a bridge and get over yourself....you queenie.

time to evolve said...

last name left is a queeenie? pathetic.

Larry said...

“There'll be nothing left if Larry removes all the Alex Jones stuff.”

A lie. I have nearly 300 articles that I have written alone.

“Larry thinks Alex Jones is manipulative and dishonest......except when Alex is dealing with 911 Troof.”

Another lie. Alex is right about there being a New World Order, a push for a North American Union, an increased police state, vaccinations, and lots more, but when he’s WRONG I sure as hell will call him out on it-----as MANY in the truth movement are AFRAID to do.

“Somehow Alex has never manipulated his audience over 911......only other stuff.

Somehow Alex is still to be believed over 911.”

Find ONE article I have ever written that indicates that my beliefs concerning 9/11 are because of ALEX JONES. Find ONE. You wont, because there’s none. Like Ive said in other posts. I completely disagree with Bill Maher on 9/11, but I think he’s 100% correct about religion. I oppose Bill O Reilly about 90% of what he says, but he’s correct on illegal immigration. What’s your point? Because I expose someone’s lies on ONE issue, that means they are incorrect about everything they’ve ever said? Insanity!

the_last_name_left said...

L: Alex is right about there being a New World Order

Define "new world order", please.

I bet you can't.

L: an increased police state, vaccinations

oh big deal.......like vaccinations don't exist? Who claims they don't exist? Who isn't cognizant of ideas of the creep of "police state"? Come on! Even David Icke or Hitler could give a vague description of the world and get some things right.

L: Find ONE article I have ever written that indicates that my beliefs concerning 9/11 are because of ALEX JONES.

well, ok - I'll have a look.

But what exactly do you disagree with Alex Jones about......specifically in regard to 911 conspiracy? Not much?

And the fact remains that much of your site would disappear if you removed "alex jones" and all his stuff.

I haven't said you should remove it. I don't take anyone seriously when they link to Prisonplanet. It's shit. What little writing they bother to do themselves is exaggerated, soaked in hyperbole, inaccurate, distorted, partisan, self-serving.......total crap.

Larry said...

Better yet, ask Gordon Brown what he means by NWO here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KbU_Po4sfnw

Ask daddy Bush what he means by NWO here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rc7i0wCFf8g

and here:

http://www.youtube.com/
watch?v=xvzwzaifJYI&
feature=related

Ask Obama what he means by NWO here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DPr3jT1zyrs&feature=related

Who said I DENIED vaccinations? Im taking about what is IN vaccinations, you ignoramous!

The New World Order is the plan by any and all who push for a World Government

Larry said...

"And the fact remains that much of your site would disappear if you removed "alex jones" and all his stuff."

I have nearly 300 articles that I wrote ALONE. ME, I wrote them. So, even if this site ONLY had MY articles on them, I average posting an article by MYSELF every 3 days. How many articles have YOU written on YOUR site? 3?

the_last_name_left said...

No - I asked you for your definition......Alex Jones' definition.....

Not Gordon Brown. Or Obama.

Likely they mean totally different things to what you or Alex could ever contemplate.

So i was right - you can't give a definition.

As i was saying previously - Alex Jones and his followers' use of "NWO" is a placeholder for anything and everyhting they choose to protest this week. It's incoherent, vague and amorphous. It can mean ANYTHING. It means NOTHING.

As it is so indefinite an idea......how can we be sure Alex doesn't actually mean "jews" when he says "NWO"?

Larry said...

Apparently you must have read the first 3 words of my post and stopped reading, or you read it all and your retardation got in the way. I DID give a definition in the EXACT SAME post! Here it is AGAIN for you, the reading impaired:

“The New World Order is the plan by any and all who push for a World Government”

Reading is a wonderful thing once you get the hang of it!

Anonymous said...

thats a good one larry. you own him and his site. hes a tird and a queenie.

Messianic Akratist said...

Actually the UK Public Health Service IS socialist - and ineffective. Medical care is a scarce good (economic definition) and therefore must be rationed. If it is not rationed by cost (free market) then it will be rationed by the government or whoever provides it, according to their preferences.
The Federal Reserve is a privately owned institution, but its head is appointed by the President. And it has been (unconstitutionally) granted BY the government a monopoly on creating and regulating "money."
The problem with Marx's concept of "free" central bank created capital is that capital must be real - it must have some actual value. It cannot be just made up.

the_last_name_left said...

Marx was a materialist - he derided "made up stuff".

And yes, of course the UK NHS is closer to "socialist".......NOT "fascist" as you earlier suggested.

And yes, I agree socialised healthcare is "rationed" in the sense demand is limitless and supply is not.

That's a fundamentally more democratic and egalitarian principle than having it rationed by "the market".....the wallet.

Why should the most financially capable receive all the benefits? that's amoral imo.

conservatives love to bemoan the loss of "community".......even as they seek to deprive the community of healthcare.....and justify their self-interested paradigms.

Sure - argue for inequality and individualism - but don't expect your anti-social paradigm to do anything except undermine social cohesion etc.

Larry said...

Turd----I’m officially done with you. I think it’s clear to everyone [even your pal Socrates] that I have completely smoked you on 9/11. If you’d like to THINK that you’ve run me away because of the fact that Im not letting you waste one more minute of my time on brainless morons like you, then feel free to think it.

Anonymous said...

great one larry, you own him. hes your bitch. hes a turd and a queenie.

Daniel Edd Bland III said...

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Anonymous said...

Кажется, это подойдет.